These are few mails between a NRI Women and me, it a example how they react and they Love to see husbands old parents and his sisters are harassed with false case on them.
She sent link of 2 comment where it says 498A is wisely used.
I wrote >>
thats opinion of just 2 people;
we have 6000 plus families who says its 100% false.
i can creat a thread in yahoo answers and say its 100% false and i can get more reply to the same than the link you sent.
She replied. >>
Come on!!! This is what needs to change. Am I saying it’s 100% true? Then why do you have to argue that it’s 100% false?
This is just fanatism.
All I was asking you is to think about it. Instead what’s your problem – what do you want – just fight?
Do you think your being adamant is perfect? So much anger against any person is not good for anyone.
You already have a strong network who believe that it is 100% false. You go on rallies, protests, write caustic blogs and anything and everything which has negative connotation. So, no doubt you can get 10000 plus families. That’s not that big a deal.
The big deal is to bring the change, talk about the solutions rather than just keep fighting and protesting creating more problems.
To me, it looks like you are not ready for constructive thinking. I don’t want to fight or argue further.
I Replied >>
im not against Women, and we fight aginst only those who misuse laws to harass;
for us, men its ok to go to jail, we dont mind, but along with us, it drags our old aged parents and married sisters along with their breastfed babies too.
and as you wrote, many true cases ignored because of your own kind who misuse such laws.
and we have female members in MyNation Foundation who fight for their broters, and Sisters who are harassed by their husband families.
we fight because government is not ready to listen to make laws gender equal because feminists blocks them and make money out of other women problems.
they get more than 7 crore grant every year, if you ask them where that money goes, they have no answer but reports of harassment of women is not decreased either.
go to any women forum, and ask them, and see what they will advice, no need to say, they will advice you to file false case on her husband family only.
so it is not us, men to change. it is your own kind to think, you are not subordinate but you want equal status and ready to take equal responsibility too.
She replied. >>
Please go ahead and fight. Neither will you nor your old aged parents, married sisters and their breastfed babies will have peace!!!
I was talking for peaceful resolution.
And what do you mean by “own kind”? I’m a well-educated NRI working girl. I have seen quite a few of my friends suffering without having filed any 498a cases. Are your organizations accounting for that suffering? Their husbands have harassed, divorced and married another girl while the poor girls are suffering without being able to prove. And these friends of mine are also well-educated NRI working girls!!! It’s amounting to so much that they are losing interest in their career, getting frustrated and depressed for the injustice meted by men. Well, they approached their mother-in-law, father-in-law, sister-in-law and everyone they could to save the relationship, but male-ego wouldn’t let any of them hear the girl’s voice. Why does the girl complain if she’s well-treated in a family? I’m not a feminist in any sense.
What do you mean by misuse? I read your link and the Karan Thappar’s interview with Renuka Choudhary. The man was asking if calling the girl’s relative “ass” is abuse. Why not? Would a man take if a woman calls any of his relatives(his mother, father or sister) “ass”!!! More than 75% of Indian men would immediately start a big fight. While the same men expect women to shut their mouths. Men can be sarcastic, but women cannot!!! And often these men just don’t say it once, they make such repeated sarcastic comments repeatedly.
Female members in your organizations is the root cause of the entire problem. These women should have empathized with other women. Is there even a single man in women’s organizations? Do men really come forward to fight for women’s issues. Unfortunately, NO. Then why should women members fight for your organization. That is only because you are their son or brother. So, it’s a man who divides women. But, never did a woman try to divide men. Such great men you all are!!! Hats off for your intelligence!!!
By the way do you know that there is a difference between equality and equal dignity.
Equality is a static process. It talks about laws, rules, rights, etc. These are well-defined.
Equal dignity is a dynamic process. All of us need to adapt depending on the circumstances. Each incident teaches us how we should treat the other person.
Yes, fighting may be a solution for equality but not equal dignity. But what is essential for you, me and for the generations to come is equal dignity not equality. In all my communication, I’m maintaining equal dignity but unfortunately you are not.
Please provide me links for women’s forums where they discuss about men in such caustic tone. I’ll definitely raise my concerns if they are just bitching against men without concrete results. I could find only these anti-women forums, but not women forums. This itself proves how much male-dominated our society is. And such an organization which keeps talking negatively of women fights for gender equality. Isn’t it ridiculous? Gender equality means you have to be unbiased. You have to empathize with hundreds of other women who are truly suffering (instead of branding every case as false). That’s probably the reason no legislation is happening after reading your blogs, articles, caustic comments, etc. Try to be unbiased first.
Men – you need to wake up. Women cannot bring the change without men’s support. And the change that you are requesting is incorrect. Fight for women issues too. As I said, I’m not saying all women are good. But at the same time you need to understand whatever you are writing about women, the same qualities could be there in men too. And to be honest since our society has been over the years male-dominated, the qualities that you write in your blogs about women (greedy, lies before marriage, infidelity, control, asking to leave man’s siblings/parents) are actually more common among men. Please don’t think about your specific case.
Think bigger and stop this narrow thinking.
Our mothers and grand mothers never would have filed these cases. More of these cases are being filed by women only because women have changed.
What is missing is – men’s change!!! This is the harsh reality for all the men folks. If you want women to change more and more, then there will be no institution of marriage, no bright future for the kids, no trust, no love and nothing in the society. This is what happened in westernized countries and that’s the reason for divorce rate being 50% and hardly any kids stay with parents after they turn 16. Is this what you want Indian society to be like? Whether you want it or not, if you continue to fight like this without finding solution, this is what will happen. It’s your choice – whether you want to change your mind and then try to change your friends mind and so on.
I’m not sure of your background and if all this even makes sense. I think I’m trying to do my bit for a better society. I’m neither a supporter of organizations like you nor of feminist organizations. That’s the reason I’m trying to reach both kind of organizations. There are a few like-minded people like me and among them there are a few men too. We’ll see what we can do!! We might fail because of your and feminists fights, but please don’t bother about us. You continue with your fight against the woman who has harassed you, poor old-aged parents, married sisters with breast-fed babies. After your fight is over and she eventually gives up or compromises (even though it might not be false), I hope you would continue to help your other male friends. Otherwise, you would be branded as selfish, isn’t it?
Wish you the very best.
Dear All,
It’s nice to hear from all of you. Highly appreciate it.
I just want people to think a little differently. If you want to get something, you can’t go against it. And any time, I believe it’s important to garner support. The more support, the better. Given that, SIF is losing support for being biased and working against women, supposedly the weaker sex. I understand all of your agony as well, but that’s definitely not the right approach. In the process, you are helping untruthful men and victimizing more women. This has to be changed.
Why I’m sticking with SIF and not joining a women’s organization? SIF is widespread and I believe it can make a lot of difference if applied in a constructive way. The point everyone needs to understand is look at others problems than our personal issues. Prior to last week, I was entagled and frustrated with no solution to my personal issues. I definitely was not happy hearing my friends go through suffering and moreover I was concerned about the divorce rates and children. I wanted the change where women and men don’t fight, but provide solutions. In most of our cases, what was missing was proper guidance for both women and men. And that’s the reason for so much discord between men and women these days. Parents of either side influence their sons or daughters. The thing which was missing was someone giving an unbiased opinion. Communication gap between men and women has to bridged.
This is what I am proposing:1. Allow both men and women to approach SIF. Whoever approaches first take them into confidence, spend enough time to understand the problem. Start asking “What’s that you want us to help with?” and go deeper to understand if she/he is indeed telling the truth. Ask them if they have any proofs. Communicate with both the parties in an unbiased way. I guess this is pretty much you are doing, but I’m just saying do it with both the genders. It’s like we are volunteering to do the mediation. If the other party is not reachable, we need to come up what we can do. Try to communicate with the both in an unbiased tone explaining the kind of problems they face because of divorce or 498a. And rest is upto them to decide, but we can tell disadvantages of being revengeful and prolonging for longer time.
2. No blogs or articles targeting women. Preferably gender neutral thoughts and articles. So, how to raise kids with high self-esteem, how to bring harmony between men and women, etc. There can be articles on each gender, but please maintain sophistication in the language. Share books and ideas.
3. We can even volunteer to take up cases lying in the police stations and let them come up with a resolution. Please understand there is no point taking the case all the way to trial. Why waste our precious time and energy for something which is not productive. We need to show the other person that we are doing good work, unlike them who really caused us so much suffering and still causing. We need to tell them that we don’t care about the suffering they cause us. Our prosperity is their downfall. Let’s prosper in every walk of our lives.
4. Provide legal advice to genuine cases for both genders. Coordinate with lawyers and provide references. I’m sure lawyers will also help if we are fighting for a good cause – saving Indian families.
There may be many many more such ideas. All these are not just my own. This is how domestic violence counseling centers in USA work. I can share you the links. Very well structured. And provide real solace for the victims – making the victims talk will help us to analyze the person. Unfortunately, even in USA these centers have only women volunteers.
I feel that’s the problem. A man has stronger voice in social issues because he can spend lot of time when compared to a woman.Let SIF be the first organization where men and women work together. Women’s organizations will be surprised about the change. And let’s prove to them that we are THE ORGANIZATION.
I want all of us to work collectively. No single person is a leader. Anyone and everyone’s ideas should be taken. This way we’ll be engaged in constructive work + in parallel fight for gender-equal laws. Stressing too much on laws is not good, is not leading us anywhere.
Hope you are getting the point.I might not be able to devote much time on a couple of days in a week, but whenever possible I’m more than ready if you are ready.My intention is only to put this thought across and make you thinking.
Please let me know what you think!!!
Best Wishes,Sushma
PS : For whatever reason I think there is a delayed response when I post. I see all of your posts, but not mine on yahoo groups. — The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don’t do anything about it – Albert Einstein.
Hi All,
I see the pain and agony of most of you fighting against 498a and for gender equal laws.
MR : you should see the sprirt of truth as well. The Honour that a fighting soldier displays when all odds are pitted against him. It is gladiator’s spririt. They know not much scope but they fight. They could succumb & agree to injustice but not. So unless you see that picture, you do not see this group complete.
I do see your spirit for the truth. I’m just warning you that all those who are members might not be true.
Further, I’m just asking you to take into consideration genuine women – if not educated, atleast the helpless/dependent ones.
Hi All,
I see the pain and agony of most of you fighting against 498a and for gender equal laws.
Can I ask you all a couple of questions?
1. Are any of your wives uneducated?
2. Are any of them not self-sufficient currently?
3. Do you think 498a is being filed by any uneducated or dependent woman?
4. How many of these false cases allege physical harassment?
5. Hypothetically, if 498a is completely removed (forget about amendment),what do you think will happen?
Will it result in less stress in relationships and lower divorce rates? And if so, how?
I’m a woman and I want to look at it in an unbiased way. Can you please help?
Trust me – I’m not trying to bombard at you or criticize you. Honest attempt to know what the problem is.
Best Regards,
Sushma
1. Are any of your wives uneducated?All the wives who file 498a FIR are educated and literate and well advised that they will get Money and Divorce if they file 498a.
Only complaints from educated women end up as an FIR. Because educated women marry only high earning high networth males. To extract money and not for punishing the husband FIR is filed by Police and advocates. If her wish is to Punish she should take her FIR to the logical end and not crave or beg for settlement.(that too for the tainted money of the perpetrator of harassment!! I would say it would be hon’ble for her to take up the Oldest Profession instead of accepting the money from somebody who is cruel to her.)When uneducated (Say illiterate women ) goes to police she is advised to accommodate with the situation. It is common knowledge that no money can be extracted from Husbands as he is poor nor the poor illiterae women (say wife of auto driver or slum dweller)would grease the NGO or Police or Judiciary.Factually many illiterate women would not want to break family by taking her husband to Police!!
Indian Family System is surviving because of these Poor women. I wish you take detour to some slums in urban area.
2. Are any of them not self-sufficient currently?If “not getting into some Govt run Destitute Home” or “not being Vagrant” or”having good support system” atleast to grease Police or Lawyers amount to self sufficiencythen every wife who succeeds in filing 498a are definitely self sufficient.
3. Do you think 498a is being filed by any uneducated or dependent woman?See ans to Q1
4. How many of these false cases allege physical harassment?
I Got married on dd/mm//yy. This is only true statement in any FIR.All other statements which amount to criminal acts will be unspecificand template driven.Like ” my Mother in Law use to ask me to prepare coffee after her keeping open the Gas Stove”My fatherin law use to look my private parts when nobody is around.My brother in law use to peep into the bathroom when I shit.My husband is impotent and compel me to sodomy.I have seen my Husband use to have sex with my mother in law.and so on.Only she and God alone can know the truth.
5. Hypothetically, if 498a is completely removed (forget about amendment),what do you think will happen?Nothing will happen. There will be huge income loss for Lawyers, NGOs,Police and JudiciaryMay be arrests at midnight may come down. There are enough of laws which women can use like Rape Molestation etc.
Will it result in less stress in relationships and lower divorce rates? And if so, how?
Divorce rate has no correlation with filing of false or true 498a.If no two persons cannot live together no force on earth can keep them together.You can’t even make to dogs to procreate.Trust me – I’m not trying to criticize you. Honest attempt to explain what the problem is.
Thank you for your sophisticated input 🙂
I agree and understand on what you are trying to say since I myself haveseen men being harassed by women for money or life-size ego.Will you agree if I say there are also women who have been harassed by men?I believe you all do, but just that you don’t think that it’s possible witheducated, independent and financially strong women. If you really can’tbelieve, you need to go to DV counseling centers anywhere in the world,forget about India alone. Further there are two books written by non-Indianmale authors which clearly elicit the point1. Why Does He Do That? Inside the minds of angry and controllingmen2. You Don’t Have To Take It Anymore: Turn your resentful, angry, oremotionally abusive relationship into a compassionate, lovingoneThere might be many more, but these are the two I read to understand whatexactly is harassment.
Did you see or hear about any uneducated (or illiterate) and dependent womanfiling 498a? You didn’t because as you said you all are high earning highnetworth males!!! I have and I know their desperation and helplessness innot able to get immediate justice. There are cases pending for more than 5years. This 498a which you all are fighting against doesn’t serve anypurpose. If I had the authority, I would say just get rid of it completely.Atleast we can completely zero down on the number of male victims because ofthe false 498a. Genuine female victims will still be there – with or withoutlaws.
Indian family system is indeed surviving because of “poor” women :).
Based on the above, I hope you agree that every wife who succeeds in filing498a is not self-sufficient. Yes, educated women are and I strongly condemnthem extorting money from their husbands. I have even seen a couple ofgenuine cases demanding high compensation. When asked why they did so, theysaid their lawyer asked them to. The reasoning the lawyer gave was that ifyou demand high, after bargaining you’ll have amount which is worth thefight. Parents of genuine women think our daughters life is anyway screwedup, so why not get some monetary benefit. While the genuine women herselfdoesn’t care about anything. I don’t see anything wrong in the parentsthinking since they want their battered daughter to recover peacefullyinstead of waiting for 5 long years.
It’s funny that such are the statements in an FIR. I’m not sure if anyoneshares FIRs in this forum, but if indeed that is so, it’ll be interesting toread such an FIR.
And I completely agree with your opinion about people benefiting from 498aand about divorce.I had discussions with couple of my friends about the increase in divorcerate and here’s two different opinions.1. Women empowerment has made women independent and they are not able tohandle multiple roles – wife, mother, employee and daughter-in-law alltogether at the same time.2. Men are looking for modern, educated and working women with same patienceand tolerance as their mothers. It’s possible that men’s mothers worked too,but those days were not as competitive as today. And our children will haveto face even competitive and complicated world because of discord betweenparents.
I’m not supporting either men or women. I’m just asking you all to look at asolution.Please try to see the problem from women’s perspective as well.Do you think women’s organizations are in support of the women who aremisusing 498a? Even they’ll be happy if you can come up with a solutionafter taking into perspective even genuine cases.Do you confidently say all men here are innocent? Maybe 90% of you are, butthere are 10% who are just moving with the crowd claiming their case isfalse. How do you justify the stand of these 10% men whom you are supportingand giving ideas on how to defend themselves? Don’t you think in the processyou are meting injustice to the 10% women?Unfortunately, this forum is not ready to look at it from that perspective.Instead you all talk about protests for your demands.If we make this law gender-unbiased, do you think less number of cases willbe filed? Quite contrary men will start filing too. Poor judiciary will notbe able to handle it and the middle-men will get rich.
Amidst all these fights, the most suffering are innocent children.
There are tons of women’s organizations. You might ask as to why I’m writinghere instead of there. I have to admit that women’s efforts will yieldresults only if they have the support of men. That’s how God has created menand women – to work in coordination.I believe women’s organizations will definitely come forward if you take thefirst step.
I’m not sure if I made my point in this forum.
Wish you all very best!!!
Best Regards,Sushma
Sushma,
The women protection laws are made to give relief to suffering women.
In my case, my wife has 11 years of working experience and worked in half dozen MNC’s.
She has purchased a new ford figo car and has huge balance in her account.Now she is behind alimony.
My 6 years old daughter is very affectionate to me. I have given bath to her and brought her up in my arms. My wife is now trying all means to make sure that i should not meet my daughter. It is almost 5 months since i have seen my daughter.
I had to take a separate house few years back for me, my wife and my daughter and leave my parents for my wife
Later my FIL and MIL started living with us and i started taking care of them thinking that her parents are like my parents
After all this you should be a man and stand in the court to hear false allegations and then the whole system is seeing you like a villian and the wife like a abla nari to understand what we go through…
You will find so many such cases now a days…
Society should also think about people like us… otherwise… will there by any meaning left in the system??????
Sushma R.
see my answers to your questions embedded in your email.
Mohan
Thank you for all your comments.
My sincere apologies if I’ve expressed something wrong. I had my reasons tothink otherwise, but I realized they are irrelevant in this forum.You are right after being hurt you’ll not be able to see other gender’spoint of view. Infact, I wasn’t even talking for/against women. All I wastalking was to help saving marriages even before going to the stage of 498a.Sorry about that.
Nothing personal against anyone. It’s just that our philosophies don’tmatch.Please ignore whatever commotion was caused due to my comments.I’m quitting the group. And yes, that’s what is good for both of us.
~Sushma
We need to implement Hudood Law in this country,
Men should be given all rights & not women…. Women should only obey men & their Ego
seems like this site is created by someone who has high vengence against women
well to act like a westerner, you need to be 1…if you follow the law of a western country then get one of those law….if women want full freedom, give them but not at the cost of a man’s freedom. if you cant live with a husband, agreed, leave and move on, get ur money, sort out your life…get the sec 498a and 406 and etc OUT government!!!!
I also vicitm of 498 A section case. In my case my wife is suffering with scheziniofiniya (pychological disorder) from lang time. I do not know wether she is suffering with this disorder from chilhood or not. At time of marriage her family members given some tablates to her to relax from tension. If she did not have those tables she will not sit for marriage. After marriage also i noticed that she is taking some medicines regularly. When i asked her about tables, she said that these tables for headche and some times it is for ladies problem etc she explain to me. Now she file a false 498 case twice in my home town as well as her home town. Now they are asking for 40laks to give divorce. It is correct way to marriage a girl who is suffering with some mental disorder and file 498 a police cases twice and harrase me. It is good example to misuse of 498 A for money makers. Can any one give some solution how to prove she is sufferning with disorder and get divorce.
Let me explain how i maintain my wife. When ever she taken tables, she is OK, 3 years she harrase me like any thing. I used visit hospital with her and get the medicines and taking case her health. We went USA for my job propose, there also we went hospital for her health. i used to take case her health. Now i have baby also. She never taken case baby. She is leaving with her parents and asking for maintaince and 40 laks for divorce. I am doing my job and surviving with small baby and going to court regualry for 498 a TWO Cases and divroce case.
Need help to solve my issue. It is proved that some womens are using 498 for getting money.
Need another 498 B SEction for MENS to fill cases against flase cases who are misusing 498 A to get money.
Appreciated your inputs and help
Thanks
Ramesh
If you have any proof of her illness before marriage then, you can fight your case for hidding cronical illness at the time marriage. and please post your 498A FIR details here http://advice.mynation.net for get free advice.
i must meet with her, who pay money and sex with me in kolkata..