- This topic has 14 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 10 years, 5 months ago by Anonymous.
20/02/2011 at 10:02 AM #427AnonymousGuest
Dear Dr. Dsouza
I am starting a new thread as advised by you. I will be brief to the extent possible and later expand.
I was married 20 years ago. I did not take any dowry if my interpretaion of the word dowry is correct.. May be my inlaws would have given jewellery of Rs. 2 lakhs to their daughter voluntarily. My father, my brother in U.S. and myself would have spent about Rs. 50 lakhs for my family in the last 20 years. But the jewellery was always with my wife and she had access to my mothers jewellery also. She even sold my mothers jewellery to come to Canada. But the Canadian immigration took 3 years because of the Sept 11 incident. During that period my father in law who was a poor man died. I got my canadian permanent resident card for my wife and son. My inlaws did not give me anything. My wife has taken back her jewellery but we did not record anything in writing.
Now my wife left me because of my father in laws death, my brother in laws poisoning, my mother in laws hatred for me and her husband, my wife
s business associates, my wifes hatred for my blind father, my not wanting another child, she being afraid to work in canada, the list is endless.
Now they have not sent my son to me even for a vacationto canada. They are threatening to go to the police everytime i try to see my son. They want my blind father to leave the house in my name. But he has been living there in that house for 18 years. My brother who has no children and my father have been helping me and my family. Now my father is even giving his pension to my wife and son. We gave Rs. 8 lakhs for my sons engineering college and other expnese.
Now my mother in law and my wife are saying that women have become powerful and they still want my father to leave the house in Chennai. They are not sending my son to me. They have not renewed his passport since the last 5 years. They are threatening to go the police for the last 7 years. But they know I love my son very much and my son is stopping them.
I am a canadian citizen and my brother is a U.S. Citizen. My brother in laws partially gave some money to my wife and son for the last 7 years. But now they say they have split. but the canadian visa has expired and my wife has not shown any interest in coming back.
How much money can my inlaws demand and can they send my father out of the house. My earnings are minimal because of this tension and because I went to India for 4 months last year.
21/02/2011 at 5:08 AM #2277AnonymousGuest
She cannt claim in laws property. she has rights only in your house. even new law comes she will get share in your house, you accuqired after after marriage only.
You can file a petition for divorce as she is not interested in coming back to you. and also for child visitation. as your son is grownup, you can talk to him about his Future, if he is comfortable with you then you can call him to canada, Court grant child wish not her demand.
22/02/2011 at 2:11 PM #2278AnonymousGuest
Haven’t we heard this story before ? If my memory holds, your son is now a major. If he does not want to come to Canada to see you, what can you do. Go and see him in India.
23/02/2011 at 4:06 AM #2279AnonymousGuest
I came to india during April 2010 to aug 2010 and met my son with a lot of difficulties. It was not a very pleasant experience. My wife and inlaws have been threatening to go to the police station for the last 7 years especially if I try to meet my son. Now she is asking my blind father to leave the house.I am a disturbed and i write in this forum. But I know had it not been for my son they would have tried to harm me to the maximum.
You and Suresha seem to think it is a problem only if we land in jail. Otherwise it is minor for you. I heard a lawyer saying in one of the videos that even if you go to jail it is not serious unless you are convicted. For the lawyer even going to jail is minor. for some unless you are hanged, it is minor.
My son is a major. My wife is also a major. But she is influenced by her brothers and mother in law. Otherwise she will not first agree to come to canada and then the visa expire, In my opinion a son is who is just 18 and does not even have a passport is not independent.
Then why do people write in this forum. Any way the cases seem to going on for 10 – 20 years. Nobody in the forum can prevent that.
I am writing in the hope that somebody who misses his son will understand my unhappiness in not seeing my son and share his experience.
23/02/2011 at 6:45 AM #2280AnonymousGuest
Im also NRI and i also fight for custody and have not seen my son for last 11 years.
at last i filed in HC and got visitation and take home for day.
unless you fight back nothing comes free.
no one will help you directly than telling you what they did and how they fought and what they got.
I have 498A too and its still runing for last 11 years.
do not think you cannt do anything from abroad, if you have wish and will to fight you can do many things.
help others and others will help you. thats what i did,
it took me 11 years to be a Father of S.I.F internet movement.
23/02/2011 at 8:34 AM #2281AnonymousGuest
I have a daughter who is 7 and who I haven’t seen in 18 months. I miss her very much. Her mother has launched enough cases on me which can put me behind bars if proved. All this so that I give up my rights to my daughter.
But if she was 18 and does not want to see me, then I can’t really do anything about it. Same goes for your son. If he wanted to keep in touch with you, he would. There are no cases that your wife can launch on you which would have any damage on you. So stop cribbing and accept the fact that your son does not want to stay in touch with you. And this blind father and his house story is just a sob story.
There are enough people in this forum who need serious help. So stop wasting your time and face up to your life, because no one else is going to do it for you.
23/02/2011 at 10:39 PM #2282AnonymousGuest
You stop using words like Cribbing, sob story. You are sadistic. You indirectly like people suffering. That is waht I can infer from your mails. Nobody will come to this forum if there are people like you. I can say the whole forum is sob story. What if I say you are guilty and so you are suffering. How will you feel.
My son keeps speaking to me every week. We went to movies and restaurants in India. He has stopped his mother from filing cases against me. I have paid for his admission to engineering college. But I wish he were in Canada atleast for a vacation.
23/02/2011 at 11:02 PM #2283AnonymousGuest
I cannot do much by going to the court. I will lose money and ant existing relationship I had with my son. Also I do not want to remarry. My son advised me not to for a divorce. Poppinder in this forum advised me not to go for a divorce 3 years back. He was the only person in this forum who took some interest in me. But i wanted to hear some real life stories and so i write in the forum. But my heart broke when my wife and inlaws threatened to go to the police whenever I try to visit my son or go with him anywhere.
You and Suresha have time for so many things like replying to some women who are not even victims. If you do like this people will lose interest in the forum
24/02/2011 at 12:38 AM #2284AnonymousGuest
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The life of a woman is of the same worth as that of a man. Not more, not less!HomeAboutArchivesCopyrightPetitionSubmitVolunteerWar on Dowry.A Memorandum Protesting Amendments to Law 498A (Please Comment)
December 24, 2010
tags: 498A, amendment, Dowry, gender violence, protest, violence, violence on women, womenby THE 50 MILLION MISSING CAMPAIGN
.498A is a significant law in India that is meant to protect married women from violence inflicted on them by their husbands and in-laws, and ensure justice in case they get killed. These cases may or may not involve dowry. To read what the law entails click here. The law is cognizable (i.e. a police officer can investigate and arrest without a warrant) and non-bailable (i.e. the court has the power to grant or refuse bail). The maximum sentence under this law is only 3 years.
Over the last few years there has been a very powerful, wealthy, lobby of Indian men, many living outside India (married to women from India), who have funded a strong anti 498A drive and have managed to put the law before the Indian administration for amendment. Their complaint is that many women are making false claims of torture and harassment under this law. They want the law to be made non-cognizable and bailable.
The 50 Million Missing Campaign will be sending this memorandum (letter below) to the Committee protesting this amendment. We request that you put your comments in the boxes below supporting our protest.Your email address will not be published. You can also send an email (by Dec 30) directly to email@example.com.
TO: Shri Bhagat Singh Koshyari, Chairman,The Committee on Petitions of the Rajya Sabha
FROM: The 50 Million Missing Campaign
A Memorandum Protesting Amendments to Section 498A of Indian Penal Code, 1860.
Respected Committee Members,
The 50 Million Missing Campaign is an online campaign, for advocacy, support and change, that for four years has been working to raise public awareness about the various factors that have contributed to the systematic extermination of millions of girls and women from India’s population.
We are appalled that the 498A law which is meant to protect women and ensure justice in dowry related cases of violence/ death, should be targeted for change, when the need for legal and judicial protection of India’s girls and women is so dire.
We would like to submit to you the following reasons for why it is imperative that the 498A be not weakened any further, as well as some constructive suggestions. [In the comment boxes below are feedback from the campaign’s supporters]
1) IT IS ALREADY VERY DIFFICULT FOR FAMILIES OF WOMEN VICTIMIZED TO FILE A COMPLAINT WITH THE POLICE
In many cases it is almost impossible for the family of the woman victimized to lodge a complaint or even file an FIR with the police. This is a problem that even the Supreme Court has acknowledged. In giving an angry directive in August 2008 Justice B N Agrawal said “In India, officials act only on huntering (flogging). India understands only ‘chabuk’ – this is the meaning of swaraj and this is the concept of swaraj (self-rule).”
Roopa/ click for story
In one of our cases, the victim Roopa had her husband, mother-in-law, and sister-in-law pin her down and pour acid down her throat. We managed to get her medical and surgical help, which saved her life, but her father-in-law was a sarpanch, and influential, and the local district court and police in Roopa’s in-laws’ village, in West Bengal, refused to allow Roopa’s parents to file a case. So the HRLN (Human Rights Law Network) – Kolkata, which took Roopa’s case, on basis of inaction of the lower courts and police, finally was compelled to try to file the case at the High Court in Kolkata.
2) THE SYSTEM ALREADY TAKES A VERY LONG TIME TO HEAR A CASE AND ARREST THE SUSPECTS
Even for people who are familiar with the legal system, and may have the resources to hire lawyers, it is an extremely long and frustrating process to even get their case heard and the suspects arrested.
Anshu Singh/ click for story
In one of the cases we have been supporting, that of Anshu Singh, who was only 23 years old, and was killed just 45 days after her wedding, it took Anshu’s parents 8 long months of fighting the system to get a hearing in court and get the suspects arrested. For those eight months the suspects were free to do whatever, go wherever, with no legal accountability. But if it took that long for the Singh family, that is educated, middle-class, and can afford legal help, just imagine how unfeasible it is for other families who are not economically well off, or educated.
3) MISUSE OF THE LAW IS NOT A PROBLEM OF THE LAW BUT OF THE POLICE AND JUDICIARY
One of the arguments made against the 498A is that women are apparently misusing the law to blackmail their husbands and in-laws. We at the campaign have not come across any such case. However, we are not saying that this is impossible. What we are saying is that it is reckless to modify the law that is there for the protection of many, and indeed by the number of women that are violently abused, tortured and killed, is still isn’t sufficient to ensure their safety.
The law as it is — is still grossly ineffectual. And the problem for this ineffectuality, both in the case of “false” cases filed under 498A, and the thousands of cases where it has failed to give justice to women so killed, is police and judiciary system. If cases are not filed, if the police investigations as well as autopsies are not carried out in time and according to proper procedures, how can the law be effective? It is the job of system to root out false cases through a careful and accountable process. Take other criminal activities for example – theft and assault. If people start filing false theft and assault cases, would we weaken the laws on theft and assault? Is that the most rational approach?
4) SO CALLED “FALSE” CASES MAY INDEED BE TRUE
This is unfortunately a very common phenomenon in India. Women who are subject to torture and attempted murder by their husbands and in-laws often return to their marital homes.
In Roopa’s case, (who we mention in #1) she returned to her marital home just a few days before her lawyers could file the case in the High Court. The reason women in India do so, is because they face immense social rejection by their neighbors and communities when they leave their husbands or try to prosecute them, even when they are the victims. Roopa was in the hospital for more than one month, and not one neighbor or relative came to visit her in the hospital during that time. When she was brought come they crowded around her house, like she was some strange animal on display. After that, they did not visit her, did not ask about her, and continued to spread malicious rumors about the reasons she left her husband.
Any woman who leaves her husband in India, even to save her life, gets branded a “prostitute”. These are people who have known her family from before Roopa was born, but they treated her with the most inhumane callousness. Roopa began to feel like an out-caste. She felt ashamed of herself. Most of these women, through long abuse and violence, already have very low self-esteem. In a society like India’s, where community approval and standing is such an important factor in social survival, is it surprising that most women choose to return to their husbands? In a country that tells women “Pati-parmeshvar” (Your husband is God) – and so it does not matter what he does to you, you must obey and respect him, is it surprising that women in India choose to return to their husbands at the risk of their own safety and life? In a country where for ages we have traditions and sayings like – “A daughter leaves her parents’ house in a doli (marriage palanquins) but can return only in a coffin,” is it surprising that many women choose to return to their husbands’ house?
It is not the law that needs changing, it is India’s social attitude that must be changed! It is India’s human priorities that need to be changed!
5) RECOMMENDATION IN LIEU OF CHANGE TO 498A
In view of the extensive violence that girls and women in India are subject to, one that has led to the systematic annihilation of millions of girls and women, it is critical that the criminal and legal system stands strong in combating such a gross violation of human rights of this one targeted group. This is unprecedented in human history!
Is there any other human group in the world that has been so viciously targeted and eliminated as have been girls and women in India?
We have a whole social killing machinery here in action in India: female feticide, female infanticide, the deliberated neglect or and often abandonment of infant girls, mob molestations, rape, gang-violence by husbands and in-laws, dowry murders, “honor” killings and “witch” hunts.
India now ranks even lower than our neighbors Pakistan and Bangladesh in the Global Gender Equity Index. This is more than a national shame! It is a national calamity! It is a human rights disaster of the kind the world has never seen inflicted on one targeted group. In fact on November 02, 2010, even Supreme Court Justices Markandey Katju and Gyan Sudha Mishra said“The hallmark of a healthy society is the respect it shows to women. Indian society has become a sick society. This is evident from the large number of cases coming up in this court and also in almost all courts in the country in which young women are being killed by their husbands or by their in-laws by pouring kerosene on them and setting them on fire or by hanging/strangulating them.”
Therefore, please do not weaken any of the laws – which have already proved quite inefficient in protecting girls and women.
Instead we recommend that each city and town have a separate police and judiciary wing set up to deal specifically with all the issues impacting on the safety of girls and women we’ve mentioned above. There should be police and investigative officers, psychologists, a medical team, autopsy team, lawyers and fast-track courts – all of who must have specialized training. This can also be the hub for organizing and monitoring community sensitivity, legal effectiveness, political impact and social responsibility with regards to the safety of India’s girls and women.
.from → Female Genocide← Is it A Crime to Menstruate?To Brad and Angelina: Regarding Rumors of Your Indian Wedding →.19 Comments leave one →
Anagha Sarpotdar permalink
December 24, 2010 1:36 pm
I support and endorse this memorandum totally. In Solidarity Anagha
Reply .Dr. Marilyn Mehr permalink
December 24, 2010 2:42 pm
Please do not weaken this law 498A. The law offers necessary protection of women’s human rights. Thank you, Marilyn Mehr, Ph.D.
Reply .Graham Daws permalink
December 24, 2010 2:56 pm
The whole world is watching!
Male or Female, every life has the same value to God!
Reply .Melanie Ruefli permalink
December 24, 2010 4:29 pm
I strongly disagree with the proposed amendments to Law 498A. All efforts should be made to enforce the law, not weaken it.
Reply .Rita Banerji permalink
December 25, 2010 2:26 am
How did we get to this point? How could a bunch of men hijack this law and decide they want it changed when the ground reality of violence on women in India is so gruesome? It is very important that women in India start fight back and not take things so passively.
Reply .THE 50 MILLION MISSING CAMPAIGN permalink*
December 25, 2010 8:54 am
Not in a country — where there are 50 million more men than women. A gender ratio so screwed that it is now irreversible! 50 million females killed! Do you get it?
Reply .Nasim Ansari-Tarun Chetna Pratapgarh (U.P.) permalink
December 25, 2010 1:06 pm
Please do not weaken/amendment the 498A act. The law offers necessary protection of women’s human rights. 498A is a significant law in India that is meant to protect married women from violence inflicted on them by their husbands and in-laws, and ensure justice in case they get killed.
I support and endorse this memorandum totally.
Reply .sbiyouthforindia permalink
December 25, 2010 1:55 pm
Thank you for bringing this to people’s attention. It’s despicable that men would lobby against this law so that they can continue to victimise their wives without apprehension. I hope justice is served once and for all, with the passing of this law.
Reply .Busayo permalink
December 25, 2010 10:11 pm
I am in support of this memorandum and i am also pleading with the Government of India to stop this amendment.These laws should be enforced and not weaken. Violence against women in India is already soo bad. Let the whole world know that you have human face after all.
Reply .Nasim Ansari-Tarun Chetna-Pratapgarh (U.P.) permalink
December 26, 2010 2:00 am
Please do not weaken by amendment of this useful law 498A. This law offers necessary protection of women’s human rights and to protect married women from violence inflicted on them by their husbands and in-laws, and ensure justice in case they get killed.
Reply .Pooja permalink
December 26, 2010 5:29 am
Indian women need to fight for their rights. The men who are fighting this law are despicable human beings.
Reply .Saren Nelson,LPC permalink
December 26, 2010 6:12 pm
I support the protest against changes in the Law 498A for all women and children the world over. Until we protect all women and children we are no where near civilized!
Reply .Laura Peterson permalink
December 27, 2010 2:51 am
Women must be protected, when women are safe, children are safe.
Reply .Catherine Onyemelukwe permalink
December 27, 2010 9:35 pm
Please protect the women of India. Do not repeal or weaken the law that protects women from murder or suicide.
Reply .Malcolm Arnold permalink
December 28, 2010 2:53 am
May ALL that is divine help people like rita in her struggle on behalf of the voiceless . how can politicians lie straight in bed at night with so much blood on their hands . women are equal we men just have to acknowledge it for our own spiritual wholeness
Reply .joyce obrien permalink
December 28, 2010 6:40 am
Please do not weaken any of the laws which are already quite inefficient in protecting girls and women.
Reply .Prabhakar MN permalink
December 29, 2010 12:50 pm
Gender Equality is the need of the day!
Reply .steve permalink
December 30, 2010 2:24 am
This law is killing basic human rights for men and their families. This gender biased law should be abolished . This law totally misued by highly educated and rich girls. Its not helping poor people as they dont have information on this. All these Feminist groups should go educate indian women rather supporting this kind of biased laws. Law can not prevent any event it only reacts to the avent.
All the cases files under this law in metros are exaggerated and girls come from this metros want quick bucks and they marry any no of men and put them under extrotion bid gogin thru 498a. All these bithes should punished very seriously. If govt can not control its use, it will become people responcibilty to sheild them against the law. If men trun against the nation it will be very drastic impact ….. Tax payes money should be used judiciously.
24/02/2011 at 4:00 AM #2285AnonymousGuest
I have been suffering the torture from my wife for the past 11 years. she being psycho I had always tried to help her. Even left my parental home and lived separately. I just told her that I have my duties towards my parents and she should not stop me in doing so.
After 9 years of staying together she presses me to go abroad and join her relatives, to which I refused. Later she went to her parental home took my child along and files 125 CrPC and I filed RCR from Gurgaon. I didn’t see my child for 6 months. Afterwards brought them back and started staying together.
After 5-6 months, she again disappeared in my absence and took the child along and files 498 against me. In CAW cell I requested the authorities to let me see the child first and in the meeting I requested them all to allow my child to appear in his final exams. The Police authorities understood that this problem has been created by the lady and forced her to bring the child to the cell. There the boy, who was 8 and grown up to tell the truth and told that if he has to chose one between me and my wife, he will choose me because I love him the most.
Again the lady didn’t allow my son to come along with me and appear for his finals. Then I asked my son if he wants to stay with me I will take him from somewhere nearby. God gave me strength and courage to show Tit for Tat. I brought the child home. It has been 3 years now and I am happy. Patience paid its fruit.
Though there are cases still running. But I feel, patience, truth and Dharma (your duty) coupled with courage are key to the happiness.
Mr Cannan, take the child in your favour and elope. No one can touch you even.
24/02/2011 at 6:05 AM #2286AnonymousGuest
Members; its FREE forum, everyone has right to express what they think right. its upto you to take it or not.
we do not judge anyone, or who is right who is not. for everyone their situation is BIGGEST hurdle. and others issues look minor.
All members will not post in favor, some write aginst too. if anyone has problem taking other comments/advice then restrain from asking.
we are all grownup and mature,act accordingly.
24/02/2011 at 8:09 AM #2287AnonymousGuest
It is difficult to figure out what your problem is. First you said that you have no contact with your son, because your wife is threatening to launch cases against you, if you keep in touch with your son. Then you say that you came to India for 4 months and met your son, who is anyway an adult. He calls you every week and you have been in regular touch with him. So where does this story about this evil wife figure into this father-son bonding story. Along with that there is a side story about a blind father and his house and how your evil wife wants the house.
Please figure out your stories and then put them in proper perspective. It may help you to see your life as a glass which is half full rather than half empty. And if this matter of fact attitude is sadistic and cruel to you, then so be it. I think you need a solid dose of reality which no one seems to have given to you.
24/02/2011 at 8:24 AM #2288AnonymousGuest
this entry i found on google log
S010600179a2a899d.vc.shawcable.net Google: Sanjay Mehra 498a victim
someone was searching on google for the word “Sanjay Mehra 498a victim”
24/02/2011 at 9:54 AM #2289AnonymousGuest
I am amazed. Why would someone want to google me with such search parameters. Thanks for pointing this out.
25/02/2011 at 3:37 AM #2290AnonymousGuest
You people are totally unrealistic and want to give me a dose on reality. You want 498a to remain and punish the misuser. As long as there is 498a, there is every possibility of a man being jailed.How do we know that you are not guilty. In my opinion a man cannot live with dowry alone and a woman cannot live with alimony alone except in very rare cases. Dowry and alimony are trivial issues. The woman has to work if they want to leave their husbands. Divorce will increase in India. So you should fight for a no fault divorce system and child custody and visitation rights for the father. Dont think I dont know anything. You people are a minority among minority and you have have not gathered enough support in the memorandum to Rajya Sabha. But you dont care about the feelings of a father.
I had sponsored my wife and son to Canada and spent a lot of money. I expected my wife to help me and earn in canada. My son being 18 now could also start earning in Canada from the age of 15. To come to Canada, you need education, no criminal record, work experience, medical check up, permission from wife, police clearance certificate and so on. My wife listening to her amway friends and her mother and brothers let the visa expire. In Canada both husband and wife have to work. Also my father in law had passed away. So mother in law could not stay with her sons played some politics and kept my wife and son with her. Now after 6 years, my wife says that her mother has asked her to leave the sons house. She says that she has lost her job. She did not even send my son for a vacation to canada. My wife had lost her career in canada and her sons education in Canada.Now she wants too come and stay in my house in Chennai and wants my father to leave. My brother in laws should pay a huge compensation for this loss atleast to my son.
I had given a guaranteed to the canadian Government that I will be responsible for my wife and son for atleast 3 years. But still my wife let the canadian visa expire. she prefers to file a police complaint against me and my father instead of having a good career in Canada. In canada there is a good legal system for women and women get jobs more easily than men at my age.
In 498a, the husband his parents, sister, brothers are jailed and punished. my wife takes money from my father and brother. But if a man asks compensation from his his mother in law and brother in laws it is dowry. I would not like my son to be married in India as long as these laws are there.
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